46. SaraWidda III

Would you like to talk with me about Land + Spirit?

46. The Human Biome

Sara is a paleoanthropologist who shares her knowledge about the origin of our species and our ancient history, freely on social media. Today we talk about the human biome, alternative bohemium childhoods and energy healing.

SaraWidda and her receipts can be found around the internet.

🌀Sara’s Website: Enwiddaord

🌀 Tiktok

🌀 Instagram

🌀 YouTube

🌀 Part I, 🌀 Part II, 🌀 Part III

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Transcript

Lezley (00:00):

Hey folks. Welcome to the third episode of my conversation with Sarah Witta Today gets a little more personal. Sarah talks about her childhood and growing up in a fairly bohemian alternative kind of lifestyle and we talk about energy work and also her ideas around payment for energy work. It was a great conversation. I hope you enjoy it.

SaraWidda (00:40):

The land and the depth of the

Lezley (00:42):

Roots is a little bit from my head, but

SaraWidda (00:45):

Well,

Lezley (00:45):

You had a very different experience growing up. I've lived in city. I've lived in city my whole life, so this is where I have to connect. This is what I have and I mean my depth of connection and relationship to land is through a suburban backyard. Well,

SaraWidda (01:09):

And it shouldn't be invalidated on any level and I didn't mean to put invalidation on it in any level, and if anybody felt invalidated in that, that's listening, I want to tell you there's nothing invalid about that. You create your biome. Your biome is what is around you right now, period. You don't even have to create it. Your biome is here is what's around you right now. You have to work with and interact with it to be a part of that healthy biome and you need to create health within that biome. Connecting to the old growth or the forest or the things like that is a completely different thing and it is definitely a difference for me. For me, it's one of those things I'm like,

Lezley (01:52):

No, like this no more. Get me out of the city in back to my woods.

SaraWidda (01:56):

For me it's something that is a very present, very frequent thing. And so it is going to absolutely be a different experience for somebody who, and there's, I don't like the way we do cities right now, but cities themselves can be an extremely beautiful thing. We see that a lot of documented knowledge of the northeastern nations were dense huge cities, right? Thousands of peoples in these cities and they're living in the forest in ways that are so interconnected with the biome that they disappear when the time comes. Right. That's awesome. When they're no longer there, it just goes back into the biome. So I don't like the way we do cities right now, but cities themselves are still can be a very powerful biome interconnectedness and we are at a space in population where we're not going to get away from that. We can do it healthier, we can do it better, we can make sure it's done in a better way, but we are still going to have spaces as a population contention because we have 8 billion fucking people on this planet.

Lezley (03:06):

It's true. We do cities like monoculture.

SaraWidda (03:09):

Yes we do. We sterilize everything. We sterilize everything. And if we can step, there are people who are actually, and I want to say it's a Japanese, but I could be incorrect and if I'm incorrect I apologize, but I believe the Japanese have actually created apartment complexes that are living apartment complexes. Their entire sides are all living beautiful, their gardens and stuff like that. And there's been an AI created of, they can basically work it to where they can create a tree and I'm not sure, I don't think they've actually put this into actualization, but they're working on the way to put it into actualization where a tree is growing around your apartments. You have different apartments within this tree as it's growing. I like hobbit houses. I think you could have cities of rolling hobbit houses and everybody has space of earth and then you create these hobbit houses in this forest biome and so it's all there.

SaraWidda (04:08):

And you got, I think that you could take the apartment buildings you have right now, get rid of all of this grass, plant a tend garden of nutrient, providing things like have berries and have cattails and have root vegetables and everything else. And you could create it and have it be a part of everybody who is in that apartment either has to contribute 10 hours of work a month or they have to contribute this amount of money a month. If you have people who can't contribute or if you are not, you're handicapped and you can't go out and you can't bend down, I can't can't garden like that. I can go out and make sure that instead of weeding, I'm out there snapping PS and leaving them for people that can come and get them later. There's different ways that you can provide on the different levels, but we are going to be in cities. We have to think that and we definitely have to. The biome is everywhere. We definitely have to see that the biome is everywhere.

Lezley (05:07):

Just in talking about this, I reflected on my suburban backyard and there's a huge difference where you grew up because that grew on its own and is ancient. I literally planted the trees in my backyard. They are very much like my family that I brought into the space. So there's deep love and knowing of each other since they were brought here. And it's a very, very different thing than being in an ancient forest that has watched and knows so much more. Do you miss them? I'm sorry to bring it up that way, but we are

SaraWidda (05:55):

Travelers as much as anything else because from my earliest memories to five, I lived with my mother's because it was my mom and several of her other women friends and their kids and basically a commune in the islands in the Pacific Northwest up in the San Juan. And then my dad came when I was three or four and I think three maybe. So three. We went to Alaska when I was three years old. We went up to Alaska and I lived in a campground in Alaska for a few months and then we came back down here and mom had my sister and we were living in an old abandoned train station on fur island. And then we moved. We lived in a chicken coop in Le Con or Conway, not con. And then we moved to, and all of these spaces weren't like at the most, they're towns.

SaraWidda (06:54):

Anacortes would probably be the largest space that I lived in prior and I didn't have a whole lot of memories of Anacortes. I have one or two memories of living in Anacortes and we lived on Mima Island. We were constantly moving. And then at five we moved to eastern Washington into the mountains outside of Goldendale and we lived there in one piece of property from about five to about seven a part of this time. I was up in a Muslim camp a few miles down the road for I'd be there all week and then I'd come home on the weekends. And then we moved when I was seven to another piece of property, the piece of property where the lodge was. I have some pretty vivid memories of different, there was a tree outside. We moved the lodge around a few times of course, and there was a tree outside that looked like an old woman holding a baby.

SaraWidda (07:47):

It had been struck by lightning and it was this big black tree. And then there was my dad and mom nailed a cow skull to a tree and that was a skull of wisdom. My dad drew on it and it was a skull of wisdom and we had to stare at that when we were in trouble. And my dad taught me to hunt and my mom, I learned how to live off the land and so when my dad would teach me to hunt and track, he would take me out and we had a place called Bear Mountain because we had found bear prints there and it was this tiny little mound out in the middle of a field and we would sit up there and it was covered in little bushes and so we'd look out, I missed the smell of plants. There was certain plants when I was in the Muslim camp, we'd go up to pray every day and as we would walk up to pray a few times a day, we would pick up something along the way, something of the earth along the way.

SaraWidda (08:35):

We would put that on our mat and then we would pray with that. And there was a plant up there and I think I can only hardly remember the smell, I want to say I don't think it's eucalyptus, it was something else, but it was kind of shaped like eucalyptus. And I remember that and I missed that. I miss plants. Yarrow was always an important plant when I was growing up and Mullen was always an important plant. I was growing up. And so I Ms. Mullen and I miss Yarrow and I still don. I go outside and as I'm walking around I'll reach out and I'll touch a plant and I'll talk to it. As I'm walking past it, I think I miss spaces of land or I think I miss the biome itself more than the specific things within it. So when we get to Moser, we had this pond and we would break the ice and march and go swimming and try and make our horses go in the pond and swim with us in the pond.

SaraWidda (09:38):

And we would skate on it in the winter and we would ride our bicycles into it. They had to pull bikes out of the, and then you can't ride the horses in the pond because you rode the bike in the pond and you're going to break the horses. I remember there was this plant that was like was, I always thought of it as Heather, but it's not Heather. And it's this big leafy green plant with these purple flowers on the end and it would cover everything like vine like almost. And we would have this little old cabin that was probably somebody's one room little cabin that they lived in during the mining days. It was probably from the 18 hundreds, 17 hundreds. It was old and broken down on the property and it was covered in vines and we'd go in there and hang out. And I remember plants, I think more than I remember trees was raised. So one of the things that my mom taught me from very young was herbology. Now I can't do herbology, I can't retain it very well. And so I heal, but I heal in different methods usually. I do know some herbs but not a whole lot.

SaraWidda (10:42):

So for me, I've always had that connection with the plant themselves. I was potty trained in the daffodil fields. I remember going out and grabbing, we would get lupins every mother's day for my mom and bring in big bouquets lupins for her. So it's the plants I think that's the most impactful for me.

Lezley (11:03):

It's interesting plants, we've just in the west, we completely ignore them. They're a pest. They need to be avoided or tamped down or poisoned or whatever. And they are the most prolific being on this planet. Do you know what I mean? And so strong. That's not the word that I was trying to find, but just so resilient. My God, resilient and wise, they really are just

SaraWidda (11:45):

Well and I plants heal us. We need plants on a level that we, I mean we need meat, we need plants on a level that's different because plants themselves, different plants will provide different nutrients. Different plants will provide different healing properties. Different plants can make it to where you can withstand pain more and different plants do different things and we don't, if it's not an obvious thing, we tend to tamp it out. And plants are one of those things too. So we were talking earlier about invasive versus indigenous or becoming indigenous. Yellow dock is an invasive plant. It's not an indigenous plant. They call it white man's footprints. White men went, they left yellow dock, but yellow dock is an extremely healing plant. It has a whole lot of healing properties square. And so when we look at it, we can see that yet there are also invasive species of plants that really drive out other species that we have to be careful of.

SaraWidda (12:54):

We can see there's such a vivid interaction for me, there's a honeysuckle book Bush outside my new apartment and my daughter, my younger of my daughters Honeysuckle is her flower. And so I put honeysuckle on me. We did a matching tattoos. I did matching tattoos of both my daughters last year. I've got poppy for my older daughter, beautiful honeysuckle for my younger daughter. And when I moved here and there was a honeysuckle bush outside every morning when I went outside and smelled the honeysuckle, it would make me think of my daughter. And it was this lovely little interaction and that I think that's another way to really, that's probably, I interact more with the biome that way I think around me than any other way around me. And I do a lot of ancestral interaction, which is biome interaction. It's just different. It's not like having to be, it is just about talking to.

Lezley (13:52):

So I have a question. I have two questions actually. One, I saw a TikTok that you have where you said that you are part of a community that understands that energy. You don't accept cash for energy work. What do you mean?

SaraWidda (14:17):

I do testo tea leaf reading. Sometimes you can't pay for tea leaf readings and they're an old that comes from Ireland and the thought process and Scotland and the thought process, but you're not supposed to accept gold for it now you can give gifts to people. So I've done energy work my whole life. My mom raised me to be her energy worker and I had a discussion with my mom prior to no longer talking to my mom. About three months prior I had a discussion with my mom and in the discussion my mom would always ask me to do energy work for her and I would do it whether I needed to or whether I felt like I could or not. And she was asking me to do energy work for money for her. And I told her, I said, I can't do that. I don't believe in that.

SaraWidda (15:06):

And she goes, I said I was taught not to do energy work for money. And she goes, I never taught you that. I taught you not to take money for energy work. And I went, oh, that's why you think you don't even have to give me gifts. I get it now. I believe that energy work done should be an exchange. If I am doing energy work for somebody. I mean I don't like believing anybody should give me a gift for it, but you should not be coming a demanding energy work for me every day without bringing me something to make up for the energy you're taking. Right? I believe things like card readings and things like that, you can accept gifts for them, but I don't believe that there's something that you should be taking money from. To me, it's almost like a render under Caesar.

SaraWidda (15:52):

What is Caesar's? I think in exchange of cash is not, it's almost dirty to me. It's not okay to me. And the reason is, is that's capital. It's not about reciprocity. And to me energy work and everything revolving around that is about reciprocity. It's about that exchange. That doesn't mean that people should be, well first the video was because TikTok does this thing where you follow somebody you think is somebody else and it is a cloned account and they follow you back and now you have, I love you so much and I was just thinking of your name and now I want to do a reading for you. And I keep telling them, I'm sorry, but I don't accept readings from strangers that day. I had actually had somebody do that. And I said, okay, sure, I'd take that gift from you. And then they were like, well, here's my cash app and my PayPal.

SaraWidda (16:54):

And I'm like, I'm sorry, I couldn't pay for that. That's not something that is acceptable to pay for. Now I have absolutely gone in and gotten my poem read and given somebody 20 bucks for reading my poem because I'm volunteering going in to somebody because that is the easiest way for them to, that is the gift at that point of time. It is the gift they need's, the gift that's necessary. I have no problem using cash as the gift though. Definitely not when somebody's seeking me out 20 times a day to get No, that's gross.

SaraWidda (17:30):

I don't like that. It was more response to that than anything else. There is a huge contingent of energy workers who do believe that you should not be accepting Caesar's gold. You should not be accepting, especially when you're looking to recapitalize, when you're trying to remove that capitalization. Of course we all have to live within it currently. And of course I can't bring you a dozen eggs as much as I can bring you $20 half the time. And so it's not that I'm totally against taking money, but it is definitely that I'm against giving money to TikTok

Lezley (18:07):

100%. Especially when it's solicited. Oh, I want to do this for you now pay me. But I saw that video and I went, okay, because in line with kind of stuff I've been struggling with over the past year about it as well, and I've come to the understanding for myself that you can't ever pay for energy work. There's no amount of money that is reciprocal in that. But I have bills to pay and you can definitely pay for my groceries. You can pay for my rent, you can pay for my phone bill. Agree,

SaraWidda (18:49):

I agree with that 100. Well, and my mother, this is not, she kind of raised me to not actually, I kind of sometimes think of it as she raised me to be her blood doll, but her energy doll,

Lezley (19:03):

This sounds awful by the way. All of this conversation around your mother is just awful, like abusive and awful.

SaraWidda (19:10):

It's very, it's, and so I've been doing energy work for my mother since I was really young. The only compliment that my mother has ever given me in my entire life was literally to get me to give her energy when I was going through the most horrific trauma of my life. And I was like, I can't have it to give. And she's like, well, the reason that I ask you is because you have the best energy out there. I don't know anybody else whose energy is as light as yours and as healing as yours. And I think that's because you went through so many different branches of energy work and you've studied so many different things and you have such beautiful energy. And that's the reason I come to you. It took me five years to realize that the compliment was really a manipulation, but it is literally the only compliment I've ever gotten from my mother that wasn't backhanded.

SaraWidda (19:54):

In some way though it's kind of backhanded that conversation that I was saying where she was like, you have to do this for me. And she would take, I mean I'd be curled up in a ball unable to breathe and she'd be like, I need you to send me energy. And I'd be like, I can't mom. I just don't got it. And she's like, well, I need you to, and she would just, okay mom, I'll do it. And this conversation where she's demanding that I personally don't believe that you should do energy work for money because in that reciprocity that we talk about, I believe that it all comes from somewhere. So if I'm bringing it to me, it's being taken from somebody else and there are people that are starving in this world. I may be in a tight situation, but that doesn't mean that I'm starving.

SaraWidda (20:40):

And then I would probably bring myself food. I'd be like, please give me food. So I have a hard time asking for money in my energy work. And I was like, I just can't do that. And she was so upset with me that the next three months, every conversation we had was I could literally repeat her words back to her and she would tell me how wrong I was. And then she did not go to my child's wedding and she blamed it on me. I didn't give her money. And I was like, okay, that's the last conversation we had done. I can't do this anymore. And so for me, energy work has been throughout. I think she would never be, she reciprocate. There was no reciprocity, there was no, you're my lightworker and I demand energy from you once a month. So here let me send you some of the product.

SaraWidda (21:35):

The money I didn't send her was furs that she was charging me for. She was charging me for sheep furs and she had used the energy I had given her to take care of her animals and butcher her animals. And then she wanted to charge me for the butchering of the animals. And I was like, you owe that to me. I feel like if I was going to put a price on it, I've done $10,000 worth of work for you in the last couple of years and you won't even give me anything. So I do believe that energy work needs reciprocity. If I am doing energy work for you, you should absolutely be, bring me something nice if you're coming to my house to get energy work done, bring me food. If you're coming over to get energy work done, bring me a gift. And it doesn't have to be every time, but it should not be every time without, if it's online and I'm like, Hey, would you do energy work for me? I mean I might not do it the first time, but the second or third time I'm definitely going to be sending you some cash or something. Or if you're doing energy work for me that you haven't offered, I'm definitely going to be giving something in return. So I do believe that you should be reciprocal about energy work. For me, cash is, I don't work in cash as much as possible just because I'm trying not to. Right.

Lezley (23:01):

Thanks for that very thorough answer. It was definitely about the

SaraWidda (23:05):

Talkers more than anything.

Lezley (23:09):

And you said earlier in our conversation that you don't think that we should be talking to other people's ancestors and I would say absolutely, but now I have this situation where not my ancestor, well, lemme put a caveat on that because we're all from an ancestry. I mean it depends how far

SaraWidda (23:38):

I could go. So if you are fully German and your ancestors came here in 1600 and you don't have any intermix after that, say you're Amish. Say you're Amish, right? You've stayed in your tight-knit community since then. If you are talking to the nation of indigenous people, the ancients and the grandparents there to ask them for something, right? If your idea of going to your ancestors is to request things, then you're talking to somebody else's ancestors and not yours and you're requesting something of them. That to me is really inappropriate, especially if you're talking about being a colonizer coming into a land and you're taking from the people that you've already colonized more. If you are, say you came over in the potato famine and your family came over then and they were adopted by a nation because this happens frequently, but you don't have any other, they were adopted by a nation, but their children were already white. And so it's not like they have that nation in their genes still, the people that adopted them are still your grandparents. They might not biologically be your grandparents, but they're your grandparents, so you would be free to talk to them without it feeling like even if you have none of that genealogy in you, they chose you. Right. So that's not talking to not your ancestors. If you are, it's about I could go and talk to an ancestor of another nation about how help or what should I be doing.

SaraWidda (25:42):

So many people in interaction with ancestors, nothing I do is ever asking. I don't ask. For me, it is kind of icky to ask for me, and that's trauma. I know that that is trauma, but I don't ask for me, I can't ask. And so I don't ask for help either. It's hard to ask for anything. And so for so many people, they're talking to any spiritual form is in a question of can you give I need, will you do and to go to ancestors of a people that your ancestors may have done harm to and say, can you do, is it to me, right to go to ancestors that may have been harmed by your ancestors and say, shit, that was fucked. I'm sorry my ancestor did this. What can I do? Thank you for me still being here and I for the trauma that you went to that made me be here and things like that, reparations to those ancestors or conversations of accountability to those ancestors is an entirely different thought process. Yet too often it really is directed to the two. Often I see people who are like, well, my ancestors might not be from the Pacific tribes, but I'm going to burn white sage. Right?

SaraWidda (27:11):

It's my right to, I can put a chin line on even though I'm not InUp. Just those different things. It's

Lezley (27:19):

So uncomfortable.

SaraWidda (27:21):

So uncomfortable. Right? Right. It is. And then you've got people out there who are so sweet and positive. I went and got my haircut first time in a long time, went over it was Valkyrie something salon, and I was like, oh, that's cool. Went over and sat, had the most amazing conversation with this cool Andie person, neurodivergent person, dragons all over their office. They got witchy shit all over their, talked about neuro paganism. We connected on so many levels and as I'm leaving, I noticed on their card, I hadn't seen the sign on their wall, but on their card they have a valry, but she has a chin line. And I knew that this person from the conversation we had would want me to say something and I told her, I said, just so that you know because I am aware that you don't, otherwise you wouldn't have and that you do want to know this is cultural appropriation, this chin line on this balcony because this is something we only see in the, well, I didn't say this is called, I said, this is something we only see in the Inuit people and the InUp impact people.

SaraWidda (28:30):

It is something that is not global and it's definitely not something that's picking up. And she was like, oh. She's like, well, shit, I'll be changing that. Her response was the correct and appropriate response. She's like, it'll take me minute because somebody else does my graphics, my cards, and for my wall it's have to go. And I'm like, it's not about how long it'll take you. It's about the fact that you, and I didn't say this directly to her, but she knew it's not about how long it'll take you. It's about the fact that you're like, oh, I didn't know I have to fix that talking.

Lezley (28:58):

And it's an honest reaction. It's just an honest reaction. We don't know what we don't know. And then when we're told we can change,

SaraWidda (29:08):

And that's simple 100%. And if that's the talking to somebody else's ancestors that you're doing more power. But if you're talking to somebody else's ancestors because you feel that by talking to somebody else's ancestors, you can go to the powwow. There's a whole different fucking scene

Lezley (29:28):

Within this. Oh my God,

SaraWidda (29:31):

If you're playing Hannah on TikTok, who's talking to somebody else's ancestors

Lezley (29:36):

So she can dress up their

SaraWidda (29:38):

Right. That's why you're talking to somebody else's

Lezley (29:41):

Ancestors. You shouldn't be talking to someone else's ancestors. Listen, I'm bringing it up because I'm struggling with it because my initial response was, I'm not allowed to do this. Right, but it's part of this journey. I asked and he was like, absolutely. Absolutely. Because here to learn, I'm here to sit at his feet and be taught how to be an honorable ancestor on Turtle Island. I'm being taught how to be honorable here.

SaraWidda (30:18):

So from what I understand from our conversation, you don't have an actual indigenous ancestry two turtle island, right? None to Ireland and that's

Lezley (30:32):

Yeah, Scotland and Ireland.

SaraWidda (30:33):

Yeah, Celtic. So Celtic in, yeah,

Lezley (30:35):

Celtic Celtic indigenous

SaraWidda (30:37):

Probably ish as well. So I would make sure that any lessons that, so you're talking about talking to Turtle Island, ancestors of other people who you're trying to learn from, correct. Is that what you're stating? I just want to double check. Okay. So I would make sure, say you're talking to somebody who is Coastal Salish, that their heritage is coastal, the ancestors is a coastal Salish person. First, I would make sure that you are talking to elders who are coastal Salish as well, that are currently alive, just to make sure that you are not misinterpreting his words in any way, shape or form, and that you're doing honor to his descendants, right? Because that's important and huge, but you're talking about how do I do this in an appropriate way and how do I make sure that I'm being, even though I'm not your descendant, I'm still being a good descendant on this land. And that's absolutely understandable. I would only caution that I would make sure that I was talking to alive people just because sometimes it's hard to interpret ancestors, and also because by doing that, you're then also honoring his descendants and making sure that you're, because his needs and his thought processes of what should be done or should be interacted with are because of the trauma. I mean, say you're talking to somebody from the 16 hundreds because of the trauma between 1600 and now the needs might be different.

SaraWidda (32:14):

Everything might be just a little bit different, and you need to make sure that you're honoring down, and only because you're obviously trying to do everything in the best, healthiest, most appropriate way to make sure that you're doing honor. That's obvious in what you're doing. You're trying to do something that's doing honor, and that to me is the way to ensure that you're making sure you're not making mistakes, if that makes sense. But it makes sense. Yeah, absolutely. It makes sense because you're trying to, this is the land and the biome that you're trying to grow roots in, so you should be hearing the people of this land, you should be hearing that the people whose biome this is, right, exactly. So that you can grow roots within this biome. Yeah,

Lezley (33:02):

Exactly.

SaraWidda (33:04):

To do the best or not the best, but to be as for me personally, what I would probably do is if you know who this person is, maybe find his specific descendants and say have conversations with them as well.

Lezley (33:21):

I've been purposely avoiding that. Every time that comes up, I'm like, oh, I'm very uncomfortable about that. And the reason is is because this gift of talking with the dead is something I've done my whole life, but been private about it, never shared it, never talked about it until last April. So it's connected to a lot of fear of punishment and fear of rejection. There's a lot of my own kind of shit and connected with reaching out to,

SaraWidda (34:06):

Well, I would say that that fear of punishment and that fear of rejection is probably part of that indoctrination and colonization. It is a very European concept to punish people for trying. Even punishment is kind of a European concept, and it's a very European concept to reject as well. Most indigenous nations in Turtle Island, and of course I don't want to stay all but most indigenous nations in Turtle Island, and I would state that most indigenous nations I know across the planet are welcoming to people. That is part of why Turtle Island was able to be colonized because the Europeans weren't rejected at the beach and killed off. So, oh yeah, come home for dinner.

SaraWidda (35:07):

It's part of that lack of rejection and that lack of hate for other that is in the history and in the epigenetics and in the ancestors that is indigenous and that fear of punishment and that fear of rejection is very much about what the colonizer has set within us that, like I was saying earlier, ain't no college or color creed without internalized greed because colonization has given us all internalized greed. Not every human, but every space now works on money. So it's given us all this internalized greed. It's the same thing with this fear of punishment, this fear of retribution, this fear of rejection. It really comes from that othering and that need to maintain control. So I would state more with indigenous people than with non-indigenous people. If you have an ancestor who has come to you and is talking to you, and if it is a gift that you've been given to be able to talk to ancestors, if you have an ancestry who is coming to you and talking to you that has been voluntary in doing that, especially then talking to their descendants. I mean, obviously I can't predict everything, but talking to their descendants is more likely to be met with a, wow, that's amazing. I'm so glad to hear that. And thank you for sharing that than it is to be met with what the fuck do you think you're doing? Right?

Lezley (36:54):

Which is what I'm afraid of. Yeah.

SaraWidda (36:57):

There might be some initial thought process of, well, who are you? Or why do you think you're talking to somebody?

Lezley (37:05):

I asked that to myself, who the fuck do you think you are? Who the fuck do you think you are?

SaraWidda (37:11):

Listen, I think if I can teach enough people that we're loving and kind and and nurturing, I can change the entire fucking world. Who the fuck do I think I am? And

Lezley (37:20):

Yet, no, I agree with

SaraWidda (37:21):

That. That's the only thing we can ever be right, is to attempt to do better.

Lezley (37:26):

Well, there's, sorry. Through seventh fire messenger on TikTok, he shared another creator, and I can't remember off the hand who it was who said that there's an indigenous prophecy that says that at some point in time, the white children will seek out indigenous elders and knowledge keepers to learn from. And if I had seen that earlier in my life, I saw it when I was ready to see it, because I would've reached out much earlier. I'm reaching out now. I'm reaching out to learn, and I'm being connected to amazing knowledge keepers who are teaching me. But if I had known that that was part of the prophecy, maybe I wouldn't have been so afraid earlier.

SaraWidda (38:09):

Yeah. Well, and I know for me that is the first memory I have is the seventh fire prophecy. I literally remember being two years old and sitting in what must've been like one of the rooms off the library in Anacortes or out in Fidalgo, and a room where there's a bunch of other kids near my age and a little bit older and a bunch of young adults, and there are three elders sitting in the front of the room and one talking about the fact that the seventh generation will be the generation of the rainbow, because it'll be the generation where red, yellow, black, and white is all mixed together in one generation. And it'll be a time when people ride in bugs that cross the land on little highways or on little roads. And I thought the Beatle immediately, and I remember hearing about how immediately it registered to me that I was the rainbow generation, and immediately it registered to me that we were all to walk the red road, the bus that we could should all be walking the red.

SaraWidda (39:14):

And to me, the red road was about community and about interaction with nature. And so that's my very earliest memory as the seventh buyer prophecy. That's real though. Within all of that is the top process. And I remember my mom talking about this when she was older, and there was this concept as well, there's a concept of apple within many indigenous nations, and this is red on the outside and white on the inside. There's also this concept that you can be white and still be indigenous. There was for a while in the seventies that a lot of indigenous ancestors were even being reborn into white people, which kind of appropriates a couple of different things. So I'm not really sure how I feel about that today. But there was this concept for a while that the souls of people were being born into people who were genetically white.

SaraWidda (40:09):

For me, I think it's really all about a part of that fact that we are just all interconnected energy, and if we can work together, we can create a better space for all of us. And part of that better space is listening to the elders, listening to what was and how to get back there. So yeah, I totally think that that's absolutely a powerful way to do it is to, they don't have to be your ancestors to hear them. They should definitely be your ancestors to ask of them. But if they're coming to you and talking to you, they don't have to be your ancestors. Right.

Lezley (40:45):

Okay. I don't ask for knowledge. I ask to be taught what I need to know. I ask if they have anything to say to me. I can't even imagine. See, the thing is too is I don't like that idea of manifestation or asking for things because I want to give that up to, are you frozen?

SaraWidda (41:10):

I might be. Oh, no.

Lezley (41:13):

As was doing still,

SaraWidda (41:16):

I'm stemming out on the piece of head.

Lezley (41:20):

No, you're okay. My life has changed so drastically, and I live in a completely different world now than I did two years ago. Even though nothing physically has changed, my world is different. And I wouldn't have chosen that for myself. And so I would prefer to be led to be spirit led and follow guidance as opposed to saying for myself, this is what I want. I think this is going to make me happy. Whereas if I say, okay, what's next? Then I feel more guided to a life that will be suited to me than my own small ability to understand what's next.

SaraWidda (42:07):

And this is an amazing conversation. I really appreciate it. Thank you so much for allowing me this space to speak and for having this conversation.

Lezley (42:15):

Thank you. Thanks for coming.

SaraWidda (42:17):

Absolutely. This is amazing. Thank you so much. Have a great day. Thank you. And may it be just light and full and joyful.

Lezley (42:24):

Love it. Thank you. You as well. Okay, bye. Bye.

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